tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post7192480183355712119..comments2024-03-17T09:14:13.950+00:00Comments on John Wells’s phonetic blog: intervocalic semivowelsJohn Wellshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13684304410735867148noreply@blogger.comBlogger22125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-36482430741746431502020-06-13T10:46:20.596+01:002020-06-13T10:46:20.596+01:00Haloo pak^^
Kami dari SENTANAPOKER ingin menawark...Haloo pak^^<br /><br />Kami dari SENTANAPOKER ingin menawarkan pak^^<br /><br />Untuk saat ini kami menerima Deposit Melalui Pulsa ya pak.<br /><br />*untuk minimal deposit 10ribu<br />*untuk minimal Withdraw 25ribu<br /><br />*untuk deposit pulsa kami menerima provider<br />-XL<br />-Telkomsel<br /><br /><br />untuk bonus yang kami miliki kami memiliki<br />*bonus cashback 0,5%<br />*bunus refferal 20%<br />*bonus gebiar bulanan (N-max,samsung Note 10+,Iphone xr 64G,camera go pro 7hero,Apple airpods 2 ,dan freechips)<br /><br />Daftar Langsung Di:<br /><br />SENTANAPOKER<br /><br />Kontak Kami;<br /><br />WA : +855 9647 76509<br />Line : SentanaPoker<br />Wechat : SentanaPokerLivechat Sentanapoker<br /><br />Proses deposit dan withdraw tercepat bisa anda rasakan jika bermain di Sentanapoker. So… ? tunggu apa lagi ? Mari bergabung dengan kami. Pelayanan CS yang ramah dan Proffesional dan pastinya sangat aman juga bisa anda dapatkan di Sentanapoker.yessy haryantohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16503331838637071246noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-45496324464294994392014-10-18T11:23:05.724+01:002014-10-18T11:23:05.724+01:00Spelling mistake: さよなら should be さようなら.Spelling mistake: さよなら should be さようなら.Sean Fearnleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15511353147572935011noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-88731206054374070232013-01-31T18:40:13.489+00:002013-01-31T18:40:13.489+00:00This comment has been removed by the author.Igor Dalmyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01717549154605298532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-44905096266815882312012-10-25T21:27:38.369+01:002012-10-25T21:27:38.369+01:00Japanese slight misprint: Sayōnara さようならJapanese slight misprint: Sayōnara さようならVincent Parbellehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04605133261070453214noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-81042374858914676932012-10-18T22:48:48.100+01:002012-10-18T22:48:48.100+01:00That would not be well-formed in RP-like accents: ...That would not be well-formed in RP-like accents: you can't have a stressed syllable-final æ, while w can only be syllable-initial. (OK, lots of people have a MOUTH vowel of the [æʊ]type, but that's a different matter.)John Wellshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13684304410735867148noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-84527446418250201132012-10-18T15:52:18.656+01:002012-10-18T15:52:18.656+01:00Peter Kingston,
There is a difference between [i]...Peter Kingston,<br /><br />There is a difference between [i] and [j], but that difference is in the way we use the 2 sounds, as a consonant or as a vowel, not in the articulatory mechanisms. <br /><br />"This is an audible difference, a sequence of [ji] or [ij] doesn't sound like a long [i:]"<br /><br />Because, [i] isn't cardinal [i] for you and for most of us.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11343068774549667364noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-62273051791844574842012-10-18T10:31:15.192+01:002012-10-18T10:31:15.192+01:00I actually think Kawasaki is ˌkæwəˈsɑːki rather th...I actually think <em>Kawasaki</em> is <strong>ˌkæwəˈsɑːki</strong> rather than <strong>ˌkaʊ.əˈsɑːki</strong> for most people.Steve Doerrhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18210787261745134371noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-57742312342795472082012-10-18T09:24:21.129+01:002012-10-18T09:24:21.129+01:00I don't agree that phonetically [i] is identic...I don't agree that phonetically [i] is identical to [j], there is a difference between them, a slight one, though. I believe the tongue is in movement while producing [j]: it starts at a position slightly higher than [i] and moving through the position of [i] it ends up slightly lower than [i]. This is an audible difference, a sequence of [ji] or [ij] doesn't sound like a long [i:].<br />If you produce a long [j:] sound and compare it to [i:], you quite obviously may not hear any difference if you focus only on the hold phase of [j:], because you miss the initial and final movements that make it actually differ form [i].Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06662104475960484110noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-38928704761688597792012-10-18T08:41:27.424+01:002012-10-18T08:41:27.424+01:00No-one from Northern Ireland would pronounce Kawas...No-one from Northern Ireland would pronounce <i>Kawasaki</i> as <b>ˌkɤʏ.əˈsak.ɪ</b> (equivalent to <b>ˌkaʊ.əˈsɑːk.i</b>~<b>ˌkaʊ.əˈsæk.i</b>) because our MOUTH vowel <b>ɤʏ</b> doesn't approximate <b>aw</b>. So we have the choice for <i>papaya</i>, <i>Toyota</i> and <i>sayonara</i>, but not for <i>Kawasaki</i> or <i>Okinawa</i>.<br /><br />piː mæk ənɛnəPetehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13722482936100504510noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-6000556467184360632012-10-18T05:53:25.328+01:002012-10-18T05:53:25.328+01:00vp, Jason Reid, JMR,
At the phonetic level, is th...vp, Jason Reid, JMR,<br /><br /><i>At the phonetic level, is there any distinction between [j] and [i~ɪ]?</i><br /><br />I think there is. Firstly, I believe [ɪ] shouldn't even be considered here, and words like yippee can be pronounced easily enough to demonstrate the underlying phonetic difference between [ɪ] and [j/i]. A lot of us tend to think of [ɪ] and [i] as the same thing probably because in a lot of languages (English, German, Swedish, Punjabi, Hindi-Urdu, to name a few) they kind of behave as the long and short equivalents of each other; however, if reference be made to a language like Icelandic where there is no such 'association' (don't think this is the right word to describe this), this fact becomes very clear. For [i] and [j] however, I agree with vp that "the difference is standardly defined as one of syllabicity" - but this applies only to the cardinal [i]. Yeast sounds different to east not because of the difference between [j] and [i] but due to the nature of the English /iː/. Note that, for a lot of native Anglophones, /iː/is actually a diphthong where the onset is somewhere lower than cardinal [i] and this follows a rise to a position close to cardinal [i] - so it's more of a [ɪi] which can be audibly distinct from [j]. Even if /iː/ is monophthongal it still is not the cardinal [i] and is hence, not pronounced the same as [j]. A language where /i/ is the same as cardinal [i] or very close to it (as in my native Bengali or French), such /ji-/ constructions are impossible, or even if pronounced are typically heard /i/. <br /><br />The same applies for all vowel-semi-vowel corresponding pairs, viz. u~w, y~ɥ and ɯ~ɰ.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11343068774549667364noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-76263925410848373502012-10-17T20:46:19.122+01:002012-10-17T20:46:19.122+01:00Yes. I think what you're talking about is mor...Yes. I think what you're talking about is more of an American thing. I was wondering if something like [ˈmɪojən] would be possible in England.Jason Reidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15399373762677357587noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-39648819010343790142012-10-17T20:39:32.989+01:002012-10-17T20:39:32.989+01:00It's interesting that you say that ɪ may overl...It's interesting that you say that <b>ɪ</b> may overlap with <b>j</b> and <b>i</b>. Geoff Lindsey has said that <b>ɪ</b> and <b>e</b> are difficult to distinguish (<a href="http://englishspeechservices.com/blog/?p=1795" rel="nofollow">about 80% down this article</a>). I agree with him. Thank God that I don't have to deal with SQUARE [eə] versus NEAR [ɪə] in reality!<br /><br />As a minimal pair for [ɪ] and [j], how about "new" and "knew" in a Welsh accent [or at least some Welsh accents]? I believe that they'd be [nɪu:] and [nju:] respectively. I believe that there is a distinction in such accents between "threw" and "through", but sadly I can't remember which one has [ɪ] and which has [j].<br /><br />ɛd e:vja:dEdhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04081841460525341333noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-90654508217025196832012-10-17T20:27:01.256+01:002012-10-17T20:27:01.256+01:00"J.M.R." - unless you identify yourself ..."J.M.R." - unless you identify yourself with your true name I shall delete your posts. You, too, "vp". No anonymous or pseudonymous posts are permitted here.<br /><br />No native English speakers routinely use [ɲ] or [ʎ] in English.John Wellshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13684304410735867148noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-80950107947589446492012-10-17T18:32:51.876+01:002012-10-17T18:32:51.876+01:00Clearly there are distinct phonemes /j, i, ɪ/ in E...Clearly there are distinct <i>phonemes</i> /j, i, ɪ/ in English, which, like all phonemex, have distinct phonemic realizations, according to environment.<br /><br />However, at the strictly <i>phonetic</i> level, the distinction between [j] and [i], say, is not defined. <br /><br />Imagine you were making an "impressionistic" transciption of an unknown language. You hear an isolated phone that could be [j] or [i]. In the absence of any phonemic or higher-level understanding of the language, and on the basis purely of the acoustic or physiological characteristics of that sound, what basis would you have for assigning it to one or the other?vphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16647609487352038948noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-36587220970393845612012-10-17T17:25:43.724+01:002012-10-17T17:25:43.724+01:00It's j-vocalized for me in allegro speech: fi...It's j-vocalized for me in allegro speech: <i>five million</i> [faɪˈmɪjən]. But I think you are talking about w-vocalization.John Cowanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11452247999156925669noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-45004917200998235372012-10-17T11:16:49.351+01:002012-10-17T11:16:49.351+01:00Or, better, in a word like yippie, ˈjɪp i. The ton...Or, better, in a word like <i>yippie</i>, <b>ˈjɪp i</b>. The tongue positions must be different too.<br /><br />Instead of the syllabic <b>l</b>, I'd actually ask whether people pronounce <i>million</i> as <i>mi</i><b>ʎ</b><i>on</i> and are there those that say <b>[njʉː]</b><i>s</i> instead of <b>ɲ</b><i>ews</i>?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-78999089477408916902012-10-17T10:35:09.425+01:002012-10-17T10:35:09.425+01:00But there has to be a phonetic difference between ...But there has to be a phonetic difference between [j] and [i] in a word like <em>yeast</em>. Otherwise I can't imagine how it would sound different from <em>east</em>.Jason Reidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15399373762677357587noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-26302783173927550892012-10-17T10:29:17.610+01:002012-10-17T10:29:17.610+01:00Maybe I'm weird, but I think I do say məˈlaʊ.i...Maybe I'm weird, but I think I <em>do</em> say <strong>məˈlaʊ.i</strong>. However, it seems to me that there is some leeway with the syllabification of words like these. A lot of times the two possibilities don't really sound that different from each other to my ear. <br /><br />It's funny you did a post on this, because I was just thinking about how I pronounce the name <em>Louise</em>. I say <strong>ləˈwiz</strong>. I don't recall anyone ever telling me my pronunciation was unusual though.<br /><br />I have a question: could the <strong>l</strong> in <em>million</em> be vocalized for those English people who do that? I think the answer is no, but I'm not completely sure. Jason Reidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15399373762677357587noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-2306245802159080432012-10-17T09:51:23.943+01:002012-10-17T09:51:23.943+01:00The difference is standardly defined as one of syl...The difference is standardly defined as one of syllabicity, which is usually analyzed at the phonemic rather than the phonetic level.vphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16647609487352038948noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-80343189993463507992012-10-17T09:48:53.012+01:002012-10-17T09:48:53.012+01:00I pronounce the two sounds differently. If they ar...I pronounce the two sounds differently. If they are the same, why are there two symbols and why is one among the vowels while the other is among the consonants?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-8920020702079115172012-10-17T09:44:00.475+01:002012-10-17T09:44:00.475+01:00At the phonetic level, is there any distinction be...At the <i>phonetic</i> level, is there any distinction between [j] and [i~ɪ]? vphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16647609487352038948noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-377103124456226005.post-27786681694743575232012-10-17T08:21:23.663+01:002012-10-17T08:21:23.663+01:00So, phonetically, are these words pronounced with ...So, phonetically, are these words pronounced with a <b>[j]</b>: <i>papa</i><b>[j]</b><i>a, pla</i><b>[j]</b><i>a, sa</i><b>[j]</b><i>onara</i>? And, generally, is that the phone one should use in English closing diphthongs or should we aim for a true <b>[ɪ]</b>? Perhaps, though, a tiny bit lowered?<br /><br />I didn't know your syllables are phonetic, I never thought you could, that is – should pronounce words syllable after syllable as written down in your dictionary, I only thought that was true of CPD. I mean, a lot of the things are pronounceable and theoretically possible, but I only thought the natural way would be the CPD way. If you asked a layperson to divide the words into syllables, he or she would do it the CPD way.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com